INTERVIEW

enlarge

In 2005 there came out the first musical album of Ivan Rosa "Mother Water"( Matoushka Voda ). It is a remarkable example of russian orthodox folk arts,and what is more,with strong siberian roots.The album is made very professionally and has quite an up-to-day sound and style. But, joyfully, at the same time the project is carried out with the use of the russian folk instruments.The simplicity, heartfeltness and lyricism are going well together with the modern arrangements. We've met the musician to talk about music, creativity and the modern orthodox culture.

- When was the idea of the project born ?

- In 2002.

- What was the incitement ? A sort of an action ,or it naturally flowed from the previous life ?

- In the true sense I' d never considered myself to be a musician,but wrote poems every time.The album included even some songs based on the poems written when I was 17.

I decided to keep them although I hadn't been baptized yet at that time and red everything begining from old monks of Optina hermitage up to Dao De Dzin.But they sound up-to-time now and are satisfying for me on their intrinsic meaning. I've never thought I'll deal with any musical project at all. I lived my own life, but the poems were coming, putting themselves together and for all that very spontaneously.

- But in a perfectly natural way ?

- Yes.

- Words were the begining.

- Certainly the words. For the first time they were not refering to Christ or to orthodox notions, as the basic direction it was determined much more later. It was a turning point when I was seriously ill. I remember me to be back on my way from the hospital. I could hardly walk. I took my favourite book there to the hospital, which I'd red already at the childhood "The tales of a pilgrim to his confessor",a book about the Jesus prayer. While I'd been reading it I was simply mad about this book, this prayer and when the first impressions had rubbed away, the prayer were with me for some time, but the acuity had gone. Then I was baptized, at 26 or 27. Although the baptizing were accompanied by some inner emotional experience but I didn't become a parishioner , seldom was to the Church and was out of Sacraments. A real perception and a real thirst came to me later at 30, it was a shock. After the hospital in such a sickly, diseased state I found myself at the worship in Znamenskiy cathedral. The choir were singing and as though I was hit with something, I'd lost myself and suddenly felt the angels singing together with the people . This thought struck me. After that everything concerning the church became quite natural to me so I'd understood that every russian man inside had the " depth ", the profundity, of Orthodoxy. They say: " Russian means orthodox ", but to understand how natural the soul of the russian man felt inside the temple the real religious experience is needed. You are orthodox because hundreds of your ancestors used to be in the temple , to pray and everybody understood this faith in his own way. I don't know why but I was struck mostly with this, I'd seen the beauty of the temple - not the walls, but some different beauty.At the time I was as if at the seventh heaven I felt this singing, this church harmony. At that moment the beauty of the orthodoxy really shook me: How is that ? We have such a treasury you don't even suspect untill you haven't seen.May be it happened as a result of sorrows and sufferings.

After all that my poems became slightly different. The year later I'd met the man who told me: " I've got a good acquaintance in Moscow, a famous musician. Let us record the album." At that time I was just playing guitar so I said: " I am not a professional and have no skills of singing. " " Just try ." - were his answer. I recorded a cassette for him. He listened to it and said: " If you'll go to Moscow it is quite possible to do not bad songs from this material." We had been working for a year and a half cause I lived in Tyumen and had to travel much before we had found the core-song " Mother-water " ( Matoushka Voda ).The desire to say is not enough, we should do it in such a way people want to listen to it. When the song had formed, the direction in which to go became clear to us and the texts came by themselves. After that we recorded the whole album , although the process was not quick. We had to determine how to sing it sencerely for it could be possible to listen for a long time.

- So you've got a real spiritual experience in music ?

- Yes. I've understood that even if I don't speak directly about Orthodoxy in any case I'm speaking about God, about Christ and it is a great responsibility.That is why before recording the first song I went to the Troitze-Sergieva lavra. I throwed myself at the relics of Saint Sergiy, he had played a tremendous role in my life, in my spiritual formation. I was standing at the worship and praying to him for the thing I was doing to be helpful for me, not harmful for my soul and not to bring anything to the world I would regret for later. Perhaps, this spurred my wish to show the beauty of the Orthodoxy. That is why a particular national colour and musical harmony appeared in the work. We even tried to use the national russian instruments because if the russian man heard zhaleika (russian pipes) his soul gets warmer. Cause it is our , native. My confessor, father Nickolai, didn't give me his blessing for this affair at once. He'd got some kind of distrust to a modern music. But once in summer he travelled by train with the other priests , one of them was quite young. They started to argue: " Could the rock music bring a man to Christ ? " The young priest told father Nickolai : " I myself was the cool rocker with extremely long hair and struck such a chords on a guitar. " And to Christ he came when heard the song of Konstantin Kinchev which was written in a, quite familiar to him, language of rock n' roll.

So, my confessor told me: " I'll not hinder you. " And now he supports me in every way. In other words, for both of us it was a complicated process, gradual understanding. It was important for me that this was not simply initiative but I needed the spiritual support . The work didn't fade away , the project had been carried on - all these because there were my confessor and some more people which made me always strive forward.

- And above all Jesus Christ gave you no rest ?

- It would be nothing at all without this.

- It's the main thing. I mean you've got the God's blessing for your work. And if looking through the other russian music, what is the most touching, what moves deeply into your heart ?

- Speaking about the song , I'm touched mostly with the word, the music jenre - is secondary. Say, mother Lioudmila Kononova sings practically without accompaniment at all, the guitar is hardly heard there, words are main. Either or celibate priest Roman, he has got almost no guitar but he is interesting to hear. And quite the contrary, father Oleg Skoblia has got reachly orchestrated songs, for example: " ...opposite the Holy gates,having knelt down I'm whispering: " Higoumenya ( mother Superior ), please forgive me..."" For me it was the expression of a pray-song. A pray expressed by the song and having been sung.David also was the psalmist. And in the Gospel : " So they sang the hymn and went out to the Mount of Olives." ( Mt.26,30 ) A man has , for some reason , a desire to sing to God .

- He who sings , prays to God twice.

- Sure, " For it is from the overflow of the heart that the mouth speaks." ( Mt.12,34.) That is why the text, who sings and in what janre are very important to me. If it is not consonant with what I feel, although the idea may be close to me, it is either impotant how it has been expressed. One singer arouses disagreement, the other's sung so, you feel the same with him.

- Well, here we have the principle litmus paper of every creativity - a man himself ? He always propagates among himself , if it is sencere for oneself it will be sencere for the other. Then, quite interesting to know, what audience the album has been intended for ?

- It is difficult to determine the audience, I don't suppose the album will be claimed by millions, more important is the man to whom this mood, this lyricism will be consonant. I am not inclined at all to do it specially for those who has already been at the bosom of the Church. I'd like to speak with the people who wants to hear about it but need accessible form to perceive it. I can give such an interesting example. In America I had been meeting with one bulgarian at the Greek Orthodox monastery, he was a musician. He had come to work in America and by this time found himself in the monastery. He told me that felt quite good and was going to stay there.

I said : " I'm engaged in music either."

" What kind of it ? "

I had explained and he said: "Quite clear. Very close to Visotskiy."

" Where do you know Visotskiy from, friend, you are living in Bulgaria ? "

"Indeed, the whole Bulgaria is delighted with Visotskiy. We are holding him in respect as the christian man who speaks very clear to everybody."

" We are listening to him, our parents are listening to him and our children will listen to him too."

I started thinking, why they were loving Visotskiy so much. One cannot say Visotskiy to be a christian singer, some songs have a dubious matter at all. But he'd got something that turned out to be consonant to these people.

Many people have already listened to my disk and some of them say: " No, I don't like it." Thank God, It can't be accepted equally by everybody. It is not an anthem for everybody to know. People are different. But certainly, I would like to knock until our young generation is heard. The second album promises to be, in a way, more contemporary, although the texts will be about faith and repentance. First - is the album of beauty, of Sunday of Orthodoxy, of joy, these are its main emotions,the repentance comes later. Now, probably, is already the time to weep, to sorrow and not to rejoice, although the gladness remains it is not already chief.

- Is it possible to persuade a man to believe in God ?

- By personal example, yes.

- By words ?

- I 'm not sure.Well, I am not going to do it. For me much easier to pray about this man and God will surely find a method to persuade. But if I feel the need to talk about this, for me it is just the way to be the Gods presence on earth. Antoniy Metropolitan of Sourozh has such an article in what he is talking that every christian is the Gods presence on earth. So we have to talk about Christ and have to be the evidence of Him like the first christians . Another matter , right in this article Metropolitan is talking that we behave ourselves as Apostle has written: " For the name of God is blasphemed among the gentile nations because of you as Holy Wit declares."(Ro.2,24)

- Is it necessary the song of a christian, which leads to Christ, to be about God , Church and repentance ?

- No, not obligatory. Quite possible to sing about the ordinary, everyday russian things which for the thousand years, in essence, have been filled with God. Russian is orthodox by his root and to feel this is no need to talk about it . How to feel it ? By means of different things. Not only by means of the song, it may be some image and not obligatory icon.

- Is there any need to deal with modern russian culture at all ?

- Surely. This is a painful moment and the key question which everybody should solve for himself. What culture do we now have in Russia ?

- Rather pagan.

- Yes, rather pagan. And if nobody of the modern christians creates the culture now it won't appear at all.

- Rather pagan culture with rather christian roots .

- The roots are christian but the tips are already far away.

- The tips have been already burnt out. How to inculcate something, may be not new, but essential ? How to handle with the language here ? At what language should we talk for a contemporary man to come to his senses, not just to start thinking, but to regain consciousness, to return to Christ, because the first man souls' experience is the intercourse with Christ, every soul is a christian by nature . You've come across an interesting complexity. When you started to work on the album you felt yourself helpless ,unknowing. How to make it all go in the correct way? What is the criterion when a man deals with creativity ? What is he doing in the right way and what - in wrong ?

- For me , personally, the measure was my inner sensation that this was right and the blessing of my confessor.

- Quite clear. It is possible to put all responsibility to the confessor and ask him for blessing on every, even insignificant activity. And the inner sense of what I have done - is it extremely sencere ?

- Absolutely sencere, not even one iota of commercial, only desire to show the beauty of the Orthodoxy. It is my belief, that it must be modern music and cinema ,orthodox according to its inner charge.These cultural moments are going to be a small seed which will grow to the Kingdom of Heaven or become a milestone on the way to the Heavenly Jerusalem. Because it is impossible to pen all at once into the temple, they should come to this by themselves. Speaking about the spiritual seeds, they must present in all spheres of modern mans' activity. If nothing is sown, nothing will grow. And sincerity,well...On the one hand, every author would like to submit his creation to the public judgement to see how much it is needed. On the other hand, I've got the Gods fear and understanding that I'll answer for my every word at the Last Judgement.

From this point of view, any creative act requires responsibility.

- So, the creative man finds himself between desire and repentance. Between intention and Providence.

- Yes. A man, for he is sinful and not perfect, will scarcely do the perfect and innocent thing. There will be, probably,some imperfections,but to do nothing, may be more worse, one should not waste his talent we know it from the Gospel.

- How do your relatives perceive the album?

- On the whole my relatives like it. They've supported me, but not in everything and not all of them. Something they like, something not. But, it's normal situation,isn't it. I wouldn't like to do something my children, my wife, my parents won't appreciate, just to say. Their opinion is important for me. They are also going to Christ and if I would say something contrary to their inner sensation, they will be the first to say me about it. For all that, I clearly understand that have done nothing significant . But I see what is going on at the musical field of Russia now and have a desire for such music to be present there either. It is a sort of a niche of modern russian song which has absorbed the traditional russian instruments, lyrical image and texts that talk to a russian man about what troubles him. There's nothing of that kind, is there. We have either an imitation of the western music or a copy of the Psalter.

- Or a kind of heart-rending pseudo-russian free-and-easiness and carefreeness.

- I am not pleased with the polarization of russian song degenerating either into Krasnoznamionniy choir or into Nadezhda Babkina and "Golden Ring" ensemble, no other variants. But actually the palette is unlimited. In these terms every singer, especially if he is working with russian song, is valued and dear to me,because he is speaking about the living tradition, about the living soul of the nation. The modern pop-music is already not russian, judging by music and text. And you'll feel so pleasant when find presious living songs among " rap " and " hip hop".At that moment you think : " Thank, God. Russia is alive and there are people."

- When a man begins travelling, he doesn't know how the journey will end and whom will he meet ? When you started this journey on creating the album what a wonderful miracles were coming to light on your way ?

- God surprise me every day. When we were recording the album, especialy making the video clip, it was a constant miracle, I would say. I had got a sense that practically everything was rising against us,but was solved in some wonderful way. It was so much big and small wonders that it's impossible to retell them all. Well, when we came to the Abalakh monastery and placed all the video equipment it turned out that was no opportunity to shoot, because of the nebulosity. I told: " Listen to me,friends,we haven't got the blessing, have we?" We gathered and went to father Zosima,got the blessing and came backwards.May be an hour or a bit more had passed, no clouds at all,shoot what you want. There were plenty of such a moments.Many times we travelled from Tyumen to Tobolsk and backwards, you know how many militia posts are on this wayI remember,one night I travelled alone and during all my way I wasn't stopped by anybody not even once and when I came home I saw all the driving documents, the license to be left there, I had forgotten them. Although earlier I was always stopped but exactly that time nothing had happened. There were much occasions of such a kind,as for me, they all had a certain demonstration of the Gods Providence.

- God guided you.

- Yes, it turned to be like this and I could say that prayerful experience I'd got when working on the album because I prayed practically for everything, nothing went right by itself. All came across the sorrows and penitential pray.

- As it is said in the Holy Writ :" My grace suffices for you for power matures in weakness." (2Cor.12,9).

- Absolutely, and not in the other way. Everything is the result of a prayerful sdanding before God and I prayed as I could. This ,going through your soul, prayerful experience is directly connected with what you are doing. Looking back I clearly see that I'll never sing such songs no more and the next songs probably will be different at all, because the work is a sort of a spiritual growing.

- Every activities for the glory of God is a stairway of ascention, stairway of sorrows and a stairway of joy. Your prayerful mood, what does it depend on ?

- On the state of peace and silence,because if I feel despondency, heavyness I start to pray, aiming myself to this state of peace and in some moment I feel that my prayer has been heard. Of course at this business the desire to say something worthwhile is simply impossible without prayer. The meeting with the bishop Arkhangelskiy and Holmogorskiy father Tikhon during my pilgrimage to the Solovetskiy monastery became a certain spur for me to understand this.He had seen the clip and was pleased with the song, so he blessed my work. His opinion was very important to me. For all that, we are living and working in Russia, we are united by one Church,on different levels, but doing one work,aren'we ? Not long ago I've seen an interesting program with Yurey Shevtchuk. He shot the interviews with the monks in the Optina hermitage and among the other questions he asked one about what should we rockers do, was our business right or wrong? Obviously, this question troubled him much, for his life was not simple, but the understanding of the Truth came and he was looking for the answers. One of the monks told him: " Friend of mine, the music and all the art must be about Christ, about what is the most essential to the people. If the music is talking about this then it is needed , then you need to do your work." That was the answer.

- Is the contemporary world of show-business religious or atheistic ?

- Everybody is "as though baptized","as though orthodox". Only a few go to church and take part at the Sacraments. Everybody believes "as though". There are not many really faithful people. While working on the album, the man, who made the clip, put his cross on and went to the temple to pray for the first time for many years. He realized that one could do nothing without prayer however hard he tried. He told me later: " Listen,we have done it quite o'key, I've even been to the temple for it." This is important for me.It is worth all the expended efforts.Or some musician, the guitar player,having heard our music for the first time asks me what am I singing about.Very often the musicians takes the Orthodoxy as the element of culture and tradition. They can not percieve the life in God.But not only the musicians.Much people are living like this.

- What is the main attribute of the christian creative work ?

- A way to Christ.Creativity is one of the ways to feel a single whole with the Christ.

- Do you consider the album to be claimed for ?

- The creative work is such thing that you never know beforehand what will be at the end. I could not suppose how it all would turn on either.I was just busy with the project and did not think that my music would spread all over Russia and abroad in the Ukraine, at the russian diaspora of Israel . The song "Mother-Water" (Matoushka Voda) we gave to a certain number of radiostations and they played it as much as possible. The stations "Russia" and "Maiak" played it on Easter because there was no such songs that would be clear for people and contemporary at the same time.Now the song is living its own life.

- The video clip on this song is worth a high price at least because a little boy from the children's home was baptized during the shooting process.

- Yes, everything is at the hands of Providence.If the rotation of the album will be more or less active many people will hear and see it, so a number of different opinions will appear. Some will say: " Good ", the others - " Bad " and even this will influence on what direction you should change.

- For one it will be the signal that shows the way, for the others it will be a sort of a stop signal. But all of them will get something like a spiritual discovery ,in this terms.

- We are not aware of what will be a respond to our word. God only knows. I believe everyone will get what he needs most.

(All the photos at the page are the shots from the clip "Mother-Water" (Matoushka Voda))